Broquet - Any good?

[centurion]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

Your comments not very helpful (useful) leh. You hint hint 'not favourable' but don't want to say anything.

he's trying his best, c'mon. You must read yourself, because R2D-UM2 may not be qualified to understand 'molecular structure of fuel' enough to teach you. If he did he would have sumarized it for you here, telling you in a single sentence.

He really cannot say much more because he may not know much more. But he know that he doesn't sell magnets.

Honestly I really think it is weird that people say that they understand the promotional literature and they promote the pop science in the promotional literature as it it were FACT. In truth the only thing that a layman could understand, would be the independent dyno reports, which in their absence, they should quote the promotional literature as `how the manufacturer claims it works' instead of quoting it as `how it works'.

All these sound like magnetic matress pyramid scheme. Really, these catalysts, regardless of their efficacy, should be sold like Amway and NuSkin - using the pyramid selling system. Because the BOM is cheap enough anyway ...! And without independent dyno testing results by established agencies, they require the word of mouth of unqualified people to sell anyway.

 

[edlms]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

Greenplus is a catalyst that enables fuel to burn at a much faster rate as the hydrocarbon chains are broken up which enables oxygen molecules to get around the fuel easier. Thus when your fuel burns, it burns faster thus generating more power. It does not change the octane level of your fuel and so your base fuel must still be used. Doubling the dosage does not increase the power too, so stick to the recommended dosage.

If you drive normally, you will find that you get off the throttle faster as your car revs up faster. Unfortunately, the feeling is addictive and drivers usually go harder .....please don't own up... ha hah.....and this has the nasty effect at the petrol pump. But what the heck? You are driving the ultimate driving machine ? Its not the ultimate shopping trolley.

It is a catalyst and as such, is consumed during the running of the engine. Treatment is 25ml:40L of fuel. And a bottle is $32.

BTW, there is another plus side, becos the fuel burns harder, there is a chance that deposits within the combustion chamber get slowly burned away.

There is a thread on it.

Cheers...

Hi, I'm considering testing out this product and would like to clarify a few things.

1. is there any literature or direction you can point for me to read on how the catalyst enables the fuel to burn faster?
2. what is meant by "there is a chance" deposits will get slowly burnt away? is there a chance that the deposits won't get burnt away?
3. what is the volume of one bottle?
4. if your salesman talk is "but what the heck? You are driving the ultimate driving machine? Its not the ultimate shopping trolley.", does this mean i cannot put this into my mom's Merc or my friend's Mazda? What's the sales pitch to the other car brands?

Thanks.

Cheers

 

[Shaun]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

To all..


Here's a real story..

Guy drives a 280hp car, changes hardware and tune to take it to target supposed to exceed 400 hp . Hops in it takes it for a test drive, declares it wonderful, Drive around the next couple of days without complaint, totally in love with the car. Only then discovers massive intake tract leak in the system. Fixes it and right after can feel the 100 hp or so he's been down. Says it is like night and day. In the past he'd ridden in and driven many other cars about as or more powerful, so would have known what 400hp feels like.

This same guy was emphatic about Broquet working. Loved electrical boosters, grounding, and other little doo dads too.

Can't feel 100 hp loss, but can feel 5 hp gain.

==

1) The mind is soft
2) Sociology weighs in so strongly on issues which are supposed to be objective (you could write a book on this)
3) Butt feel when it comes to very fine gains, is worthless.
4) Ricebowl is the most important things in the world, but the idea is always to have some options and never have to resort to untruths to survive and then have to defend the untruths with your life and your band of soft-minded friends. ie. sell almost purely by sociological work, or people determined to convince themselves a product works for whatever other reason (above story), and not on any true product merit.

==

Why can't Ferrari owners do little things for performance or fuel saving, when BMW owners can?

==

An older thread that has covered a lot of this before.. http://www.bmw-sg.com/forums/bazaar-bmw-parts-accessories/21381-green-plus-fuel-catalyst.html

 

[MapleLeaf]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

To all..

==

An older thread that has covered a lot of this before.. http://www.bmw-sg.com/forums/bazaar-bmw-parts-accessories/21381-green-plus-fuel-catalyst.html

I spend the last one hour reading the eight pages (in between breakfast). A few points I noted. (Purely my feeling. No right or wrong)

1. Lots of argument between mind and body (actual quantifiable data).
2. If those members who attested to it are real (verified real people), there appears to be many people who has a positive impression of Green+
3. Did not hear of any negative repercussions like error sensor reading, or consequecial damages.

My feeling about it: No harm trying.

PS: I too feel that Shell V-Power is better (butt feel) than 98; and that 98 is better than 95. But a hundred others will think otherwise. So I alternate between V-Power and 98. Occasionally, after an expensive dinner, I go for 95! Happy happy lor.

 

[eric3417]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

I've used Broquet since year 2000/2001 when they were initially brought in.
So far it's been on 7 of my different rides. I'm a convinced and happy motoring user.
It's best to work together with your In-Tank as well.




Cheers!

 

[futron.sim]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

Hi, I'm considering testing out this product and would like to clarify a few things.

1. is there any literature or direction you can point for me to read on how the catalyst enables the fuel to burn faster?
2. what is meant by "there is a chance" deposits will get slowly burnt away? is there a chance that the deposits won't get burnt away?
3. what is the volume of one bottle?
4. if your salesman talk is "but what the heck? You are driving the ultimate driving machine? Its not the ultimate shopping trolley.", does this mean i cannot put this into my mom's Merc or my friend's Mazda? What's the sales pitch to the other car brands?

Thanks.

Cheers

I did use green plus (bought them out of curiousity). I have to say it did work for my E36. the low end torque did improve and fuel comsumption jump to almost 9.8Km/L (previous only around 9-9.2Km/L).

I do not know much abt the greenplus product but after reading what R2D has posted, I don't think there is any voodoo magic behind it, just plain science.

The fuel we pumped into our car is not a single compound. It consist of various organic compounds (eg. alkanes, alkene, benzene etc).

Recalling I have studied from my 'a' levels back then, there is a process called catalytic cracking of breaking long chain hydrocarbon into shorter chains. Shorter chains are easier to ignite compared to longer chains and its more violatile as well.

Getting Energy from Combustion

Scroll to the bottom of the page. It list the amt of energy released during combustion for alkanes. We can see that as the chain gets longer, the amt of energy it releases when burnt gets lower (eg. 50.1MJ for methane and 11.4MJ for butane). Thus to get more energy, its better to have shorter chains of hydrocarbon.

More energy during combustion = higher temperature = more power.

I am not exactly sure about this part but I think the combustion inside the cylinder is not spontaneous. The flame starts from the spark plug and expands towards the walls of the cylinder. Different compounds have different amt of energy it needs to adsorb before it will ignite). Longer chains definitely need more energy than shorter ones.

Thus I think this will affect the speed in which the flame spreads and hence the rate of combustion inside the cylinder. The faster the fuel burns, the more energy it will release per unit time and hence more power.

Of course, there is much more than these and the type of chains (the shape of the chain) affects the combustion as well.

Btw, I did read from the net and saw in documentaries that using ethanol as a fuel will create more energy compared to conventional petrol. Considering the fact that entanol's chain (CH3CH2OH) is shorter than most of the molecules in our petrol, it does make sense why ethanol gives more energy.

 

[centurion]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

I don't think there is any voodoo magic behind it, just plain science.

you cannot make that statement without having a independent scientist make a critical appraisal of what's going on. Or somebody work out the chemical mechanics on how it works.

A Pop Science explaination cannot make this `plain science'.

Until somebody knows the actual mechanics on how it works, it's still voodoo.

They taught this in secondary school. it's the scientific method.

 

[Apogee89]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

Herman,

Here's my 2 cents worth.

Can't recall all the details but a few years back l witnessed a Cosworth Ford (Escort or Sierra?) tuned on a local dyno and it pushed out well over 200 whp .

Came back with a (huge) inline Broquet the next day, redynoed and it lost (as I recall) 20+ whp at the top end. Never knew what happened but my guess is that there was fuel restriction issue.

Draw your conclusion.

 

[futron.sim]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

you cannot make that statement without having a independent scientist make a critical appraisal of what's going on. Or somebody work out the chemical mechanics on how it works.

A Pop Science explaination cannot make this `plain science'.

Until somebody knows the actual mechanics on how it works, it's still voodoo.

They taught this in secondary school. it's the scientific method.

Yes, you are right. Its not exactly possible to know if it really works till you know the exact chemical reactions taking place inside the fuel tank.

Unfortunately knowing the reactions will require the composition of the chemicals present inside greenplus as well as the petrol. I don't think it would be possible to acquire them consider these are usually trade secret.

Due to this, the only way is to make educated guesses abt how the product actually work. Assuming its really a catalyst, we know how it could break down the long chain hydrocarbons and how shorter chains improve combustion. This itself is plain science.

One possibility is to send greenplus and the fuel sample for lab testing (eg. chromatography) to see whats the chemicals that are responsible for the catalytic effect. but thats going to cost a bomb.

 

[MapleLeaf]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

Aiya... this 30 March meeting, somebody bring along a drum of it and we do another round of testing.... (need not be free, but at an introductory price). Who supplies har? The thread is so long I lost sight of who is who.

 

[fasterthanferrari]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

Greenplus is a catalyst that enables fuel to burn at a much faster rate as the hydrocarbon chains are broken up which enables oxygen molecules to get around the fuel easier. Thus when your fuel burns, it burns faster thus generating more power. It does not change the octane level of your fuel and so your base fuel must still be used. Doubling the dosage does not increase the power too, so stick to the recommended dosage.


Cheers...

Hi Rodney,

If you will, can you provide the rate of burn before and after the mixture. Is there a test on its primary claim in addition to the dyno one?

Thanks.

 

[jinooi]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

*sniff, sniff* i smell gunpowder...

guys, it's just $32 for a bottle. don't know how long it will last though (what's the volume in each bottle).

i guess it's not expensive enough for us to have such a heated debate over. not like we're gonna spend hundreds or thousands of bucks over right?

i do not have vested interests, nor am i on anyone's side, and i feel that everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

if one feels that $32 is enough to give one some additional pleasure, whether it be perceived or real, then it's money well spent. if not, well then, let's move on... if a placebo makes us feel shiok, who is to say it is worth it, even though it is merely psychological.

i take my fair share of chances now and then, especially when it comes to all the 'claimed' miracle enhancers for my ride. have bought the calski ion accelerators, countless types of fuel catalysts, voltage stabilisers, etc.

sometimes i win, sometimes the salesman wins. life goes on. i admit that i have been suckered sometimes, but hey, a sucker is born every second.

it may not be that the stuff doesn't work - it just may not work as efficiently with a particular set-up (in combination with some mods).

there will always be believers, skeptics, and cynics. that's what makes life interesting. but life's too short to debate over $32 (when our cars cost many many times that).

 

[louis]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

i enjoy a good debate on whether products are of actual benefit or not and i think this discussion should continue.

it's not about the price, i'm just interested in knowing how and why it works.

as it is, this car forum is already heavy on threads about bling bling rims, tinting, carbon fibre lamination of anything and everything, race queens, prostitutes and KTV but is light on technical and scientific discussions of car related products.

my 2 cents.

p.s. afaik, isopropyl alcohol does not mix well with rubber seals.

 

[Shaun]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

but hey, a sucker is born every second.

Hi Jinooi, this stead stream of suckers is how some businesses survive, or even thrive. Businesses like that are despicable - facade and all.

It's not just money, it's time and money multiplied by every customer. All that is minor compared to the issue standards of of science and ethics in a community. But don't worry, those who believe it is worth debating over are free to, those who don't, can spend their time however else they choose.

Cheers

 

[MapleLeaf]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

I am game to try it. Look for Rodney is it? And how many tankfuls should I try?

 

[Shaun]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

While we're on science..

As it has been mentioned you have to alter ignition timing via flashes, standalones, piggyback, to really make use of quicker burn.

If ignition timing was already optimized, and you do not retard ignition (relative to exisiting advance, not TDC) with this new quicker burn, there is a good chance you actually will lose power due to more negative work BTDC, and bulk of positive work burn applied less efficiently ATDC.

Now if you are burning quicker, and you are able to properly shift ignition points to re-optimize, then there are real good gains to be made. Just about no downsides.

But is the fuel really burning quicker? If so how much quicker? And when you add the cost of an ignition controller or a new map flash, and time, to optimize for this new burn rate? How much power do you actually make? Are you going to spend the time and money to really find out for yourself? If in the end it does not look good, what have you lost? What's the opportunity cost with both situations? After factoring it in, what's the true gain/dollar ratio? If none of this matters and it's all about feeling good and being with friends, relaxing and having fun, would it be better instead to go fishing or play basketball, etc.?

 

[jinooi]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

Are you going to spend the time and money to really find out for yourself? If in the end it does not look good, what have you lost? What's the opportunity cost with both situations? After factoring it in, what's the true gain/dollar ratio? If none of this matters and it's all about feeling good and being with friends, relaxing and having fun, would it be better instead to go fishing or play basketball, etc.?

agreed

to each his own!

let's go have kopi.

 

[R2D]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

Hi, I'm considering testing out this product and would like to clarify a few things.

1. is there any literature or direction you can point for me to read on how the catalyst enables the fuel to burn faster?
2. what is meant by "there is a chance" deposits will get slowly burnt away? is there a chance that the deposits won't get burnt away?
3. what is the volume of one bottle?
4. if your salesman talk is "but what the heck? You are driving the ultimate driving machine? Its not the ultimate shopping trolley.", does this mean i cannot put this into my mom's Merc or my friend's Mazda? What's the sales pitch to the other car brands?

Thanks.

Cheers

Seems like one man's meat is another man's poison.

Go to this website: How Biofriendly Green Plus Works

When i Say there is a chance, i have to take into account cars that are burning way too rich that no amount of heat in the combustion chamber can clear the carbon away.

The volume is 250ml and the treatment rate is 25ml to 40L of fuel

How can i garantee that you save fuel if the added torque that you get from the treated fuel make you drive harder.

Greenplus works for all petrol burning engines. As for the diesel engines, they have a formula done up but is not brought in due to market forces.

Cheers

 

[R2D]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

he's trying his best, c'mon. You must read yourself, because R2D-UM2 may not be qualified to understand 'molecular structure of fuel' enough to teach you. If he did he would have sumarized it for you here, telling you in a single sentence.

He really cannot say much more because he may not know much more. But he know that he doesn't sell magnets.

Honestly I really think it is weird that people say that they understand the promotional literature and they promote the pop science in the promotional literature as it it were FACT. In truth the only thing that a layman could understand, would be the independent dyno reports, which in their absence, they should quote the promotional literature as `how the manufacturer claims it works' instead of quoting it as `how it works'.

All these sound like magnetic matress pyramid scheme. Really, these catalysts, regardless of their efficacy, should be sold like Amway and NuSkin - using the pyramid selling system. Because the BOM is cheap enough anyway ...! And without independent dyno testing results by established agencies, they require the word of mouth of unqualified people to sell anyway.

Centurion,

You do not know what you are insinuating. I passed my chemistry with flying colours.

If you have an issue then state your facts. All that you have give thus far are remarks that greemplus is bogus because of some website issues and complaints.

Tell me which product has had no comlaints in its entire production lifecycle?

 

[R2D]

Re: Broquet - Any good?

CP did perform some combustion chamber pressure measurements and these had indicated about 6% faster time to reach peak cylinder pressure.

Hi Rodney,

If you will, can you provide the rate of burn before and after the mixture. Is there a test on its primary claim in addition to the dyno one?

Thanks.