super2ndgen
Well-Known Member
yeah... i know abt the brakes fail means dead thingy.. hehehe.... but i don't seem to find any S$1000 notes stuck under all the desks in my office leh! 
BBKs
- Thread starter TripleM
- Start date
super2ndgen
Well-Known Member
hmm, i think i'll just wait for used Brembo sets like yours bro! Confirm sold?
NightHawk
Well-Known Member
I'm trying to measure my rims if the UUC kit will fit my 17" rims.
According to the UUC website, I need to have at least 34.9mm for dimension "A".
I tried measuring it but am not sure if I'm doing it right or not.
The UUC diagram looks quite straight forward, but when I checked it physically on my rims, it looks different. I'm not sure which surface to start measuring. :thinking:
Anyone has similar rims to what I have and can advise what they measure?
According to the UUC website, I need to have at least 34.9mm for dimension "A".
I tried measuring it but am not sure if I'm doing it right or not.
The UUC diagram looks quite straight forward, but when I checked it physically on my rims, it looks different. I'm not sure which surface to start measuring. :thinking:
Anyone has similar rims to what I have and can advise what they measure?
ah pui
Well-Known Member
Racebred said:
RB,
how much better is the UUC kit when compared to the stock 330i brakes?
any comparison data?
UUC brakes (wilson's diagram), are they 4-pot?
as for the AP brakes you got, is it the 8-pot?
hope you can advise.
i am quite blur when it comes to this so my questions might seem a bit shallow.
Racebred
Core Group Members
stock 330i front brake discs are 330mm, but is gripped by a single caliper. significant difference only surface when you are stopping quickly from very high speeds, probably like 180 and above. anything lower, i suspect the ABS will just cut in earlier, as i have explained. I think the UUC discs are a couple of mm smaller than stock 330 brakes. no comparison data... but as a modder, I always advocate precise modding to the needs that you want. Meaning you drive your original car, and find a certain attribute wanting. Then you look for a product which has the specifications to satisfy the way you want your car to be driven. Never mod for the sake of modding only. That would be wasting money. Remember, the M3 comes specced with single caliper front discs that is the same size as the 330i.
I've never tried UUC brakes before, so i'm not sure. I'm also not sure who is their OE supplier. Finishing looks to be the best of the lot, as is what UUC is always famous for, excellent finishing and quality.
The only difference i can think of, between UUC and other big brake kits, is that it's not race or time tested. They are relatively new in the game, and big brands like Brembo and AP are used in racing extensively, and Brembo is the OEM brakes for many big names such as Ferrari, Lambo, Porsche, Maserati, Sti, Evo, etc. The latter are however, nipple-pinching expensive due to branding.
The pictured UUC are 4 pots. 2 small, 2 large, gripped from both sides. You'll need 2 brake pads for each side. The model of AP that i got are the 356mm brakes with 6 pistons. Tarox has 8 and 10 pots models.
There are some dudes in the forum with UUC brakes front and back installed already. They should be the best persons to give feedback on this system.
My take on the UUC is that it will perform to what you'll expect from a BBK with this kind of specs. Top that up with excellent finishing and you'll have a nice looker peeking from behind your rims. It will also give you better brake pedal modulation and better outgassing and heat dissipation. Reduce high temp disc warp, and increase repeatability of prolonged hard braking. But as for size wise, dont expect it to look any bigger than your stock brakes now.
I've never tried UUC brakes before, so i'm not sure. I'm also not sure who is their OE supplier. Finishing looks to be the best of the lot, as is what UUC is always famous for, excellent finishing and quality.
The only difference i can think of, between UUC and other big brake kits, is that it's not race or time tested. They are relatively new in the game, and big brands like Brembo and AP are used in racing extensively, and Brembo is the OEM brakes for many big names such as Ferrari, Lambo, Porsche, Maserati, Sti, Evo, etc. The latter are however, nipple-pinching expensive due to branding.
The pictured UUC are 4 pots. 2 small, 2 large, gripped from both sides. You'll need 2 brake pads for each side. The model of AP that i got are the 356mm brakes with 6 pistons. Tarox has 8 and 10 pots models.
There are some dudes in the forum with UUC brakes front and back installed already. They should be the best persons to give feedback on this system.
My take on the UUC is that it will perform to what you'll expect from a BBK with this kind of specs. Top that up with excellent finishing and you'll have a nice looker peeking from behind your rims. It will also give you better brake pedal modulation and better outgassing and heat dissipation. Reduce high temp disc warp, and increase repeatability of prolonged hard braking. But as for size wise, dont expect it to look any bigger than your stock brakes now.
Correction bro.....
330i stock rotor size is front 325x25mm & rear 320x22mm
hehe :twisted:
'The Great White'
330i stock rotor size is front 325x25mm & rear 320x22mm
hehe :twisted:
'The Great White'
Just for info sharing....
All UUC BBK are made by SSBC, they specialize in making & manufacturing BBKs!!
Check out their website....
http://www.ssbrakes.com/products/
Cheers!!
'The Great White'
All UUC BBK are made by SSBC, they specialize in making & manufacturing BBKs!!
Check out their website....
http://www.ssbrakes.com/products/
Cheers!!
'The Great White'
piggyboyz said:
Bro, that's true if u hv the same number of pistons front/rear and also if piston sizes are the same for ALL ...but for UUC set up, depending on application, the kit can be fitted with pistons sized at 48mm, 43mm, or 38mm to allow f/r balance in every application.
So , while their caliper sizes may be the same for f/r , the piston sizes need to be applied differently to ensure balanced braking.
Whisky_Tango
Core Group Members
piggyboyz said:
Yo bro... not really. In order to demonstrate the concept of proper brake balance, it is usually simpler to analyze a car’s handling characteristics and then apply those principles back to the braking system.
In theory what everyone is looking for is that all-too-elusive handling balance which makes the car corner as fast as it possibly can. Generally speaking, this is referred to as the ‘neutral’ car and takes the driver directly to victory circle following the race. Rarely do we ever hear of a winning driver explaining that the car was a handling nightmare. kekeke...
Of course, no car is ever perfect, so there are ways of expressing how far from optimal the handling balance really is. When a car enters a corner and the front end skids off into oblivion, this is called understeer – the car is turning less than the driver intends. On the other hand, if the rear end breaks free and begins to lead the car through the corner this is called oversteer – now the car is turning more than the driver intends.
In both cases, when one end of the car breaks traction, or begins to slide, the driver can pretty much bet on the fact that he (or she) has found the maximum cornering speed for that particular corner. Yes, there are a million other factors at play which can govern the handling relationship, but the longer each end of the car can “hold on”, the higher the cornering speeds. Conversely, if one end or the other consistently breaks traction early in the cornering event, corner speeds will suffer dramatically.
Naturally, as speeds continue to increase something has to eventually give and slide; however, the very best suspensions do a great job of ensuring that both ends of the car break traction at relatively the same time. How far one end breaks traction in advance of the other is ultimately a function of driver preference (this is just one reason why there is no single “perfect” set-up), but if there are complaints of heavy understeer or terminal oversteer you can rest assured that one end of the car is three steps farther ahead than the other.
So, let’s look at how this information can be used to understand our braking system.
Stopping distance is everything and every single foot (32cm) counts. In a race track, outbraking your opponent by just two feet every lap for a twenty lap race can result in a three to four car lengths advantage at the checkered flag.
As braking force is continuously increased, one end of the car must eventually break traction. If the front wheels lock up and turn into little piles of molten rubber first we say that the car is “front biased”, as the front tires are the limiting factor for deceleration. In the not-so-desirable situation where the rear tires are the first to lock we say that the car is “rear biased”. In either case, however, one end of the car has given up before the other, limiting the ultimate deceleration capability of the car.
Just like the car that pushes its way through corners all day long, a car which is heavily front biased will be slow and frustrating, but relatively easy and relax to drive. On the other hand, a car which is severely rear biased will be a scary, twitchy ride resulting in a bad case of the white-knuckle syndrome. Imagine your co-pilot pulling up the handbrake in the middle of every corner, and you begin to get the idea. While a rush to drive at speed, it will be horribly slow on the stopwatch.
The car with perfectly balanced brake bias will, however, be the last one to hit the brakes going down the back straight. By distributing the braking forces so that all four tires are simultaneously generating their maximum deceleration, stopping distance will be minimized and our hero will quickly find his way to victory lane. Just like neutral handling, balanced brake bias is the ticket to lower lap times.
All that said, once the braking system has achieved its perfect balance, it is still up to the tires to generate the braking forces. It’s still the tires that are stopping the car, but a poorly designed braking system can lengthen stopping distances significantly, expensive sticky tires or not.
So why is brake biasing necessary?
The maximum braking force that a particular tire can generate is theoretically equal to the coefficient of friction of the tire-road interface multiplied by the amount of weight being supported by that corner of the car. For example, a tire supporting 1 ton of vehicle weight with a peak tire-road coefficient of 0.8 (a typical street tire value) could generate, in theory, 800kg of braking force. Throw in a good race tire with a peak coefficient of 1.5, and the maximum rises to 1.5 ton of braking force. More braking force means higher deceleration.
On the other hand, if the race tire was now only supporting 600kg, the maximum force would drop from 1.5 ton of braking force to 900kg of braking force – a reduction of 40%.
Since the amount of braking force generated by the tire is directionally proportional to the torque generated by the calipers, pads, and rotors, you could also say that reducing the weight on the tire reduces the maximum brake torque sustainable by that corner before lock-up occurs. In the example above, if assumed 7KN of brake torque is required to lock up a wheel supporting 1 ton, then only 4.2KN (a 40% reduction) would be required to lock up a wheel supporting 600kg of vehicle weight.
At first glance, one could surmarise that in order to achieve perfect brake bias you could just:
1. Weigh the four corners of the car
2. Design the front and rear brake components to deliver torque in the same ratio as the front-to-rear weight distribution
In other words, for a rear-wheel-drive race car with 50/50 front/rear weight distribution it would appear that the front and rear brakes would need to generate the same amount of torque.
At the same time, it would look like a production-based front-wheel-drive car with a 60/40 front/rear weight distribution would need front brakes with 50% more output (torque capability) than the rears because of the extra weight being supported by the nose of the car.
Designing a braking system to these static conditions would neglect the second most important factor in the brake bias equation – the effect of dynamic weight transfer during braking. Weight throw which unsettles the balance of the car. Again there's a calculation for this, but lets skipped cause got F=MA formula, etc...
Most cars, however, have brakes at the rear that are smaller than the front. There are a lot of reasons for doing this, and one of them is to help provide the correct brake bias. Also, most cars have a proportioning valve which limits the amount of brake pressure seen at the rear calipers.
Perfect brake bias is obtained when the front-to-rear balance of the brake system exactly matches the front-to-rear weight balance of the vehicle.
Every car has a “sweet spot” for brake bias which will generate the shortest stopping distances possible. Typically, the car manufacturers design their cars to be 5% to 10% more front-biased than optimum for maximum deceleration, but they provide enhanced brake stability in return. Not a bad trade-off for the public at large, and not necessarily a bad place for a race car in the heat of battle either.
knn... super long post....
Wow!!! I'm so impressed man!!! 
Eric, this is the longest post from U so far rite?
Cheers!!
'The Great White'
Eric, this is the longest post from U so far rite?
Cheers!!
'The Great White'
Was just talking to STOPTECH and enquring about their brakes. The thing is, they have BBK for: (USA specs)
1) 323 series E46 2 piece 332x32mm Item 83-133-4600
2) 323, 325, 328 and Z3 except Mseries (World Challenge competition) Item83-134-4300 2-piece, 328x28mm
3)E46 325 including ix 332x32mm Item No. 83-133-4600
StopTech do not know which one will fit our 320i 2.2 litre. Mine is a 2002 aug model e46 4 door. Can anyone share some light on this?
Thank you.
1) 323 series E46 2 piece 332x32mm Item 83-133-4600
2) 323, 325, 328 and Z3 except Mseries (World Challenge competition) Item83-134-4300 2-piece, 328x28mm
3)E46 325 including ix 332x32mm Item No. 83-133-4600
StopTech do not know which one will fit our 320i 2.2 litre. Mine is a 2002 aug model e46 4 door. Can anyone share some light on this?
Thank you.
Whisky_Tango
Core Group Members
wilman2772 said:Wow!!! I'm so impressed man!!!
Eric, this is the longest post from U so far rite?
Cheers!!
'The Great White'
Wilson, yup this is the longest post so far but most of the theory is from a brake system expert, Tom McCready and James Walker, Jr. of scR motorsports.
Was reading this interesting article and tot tat it would be beneficial to share the static and dynamics loading here.
Upgrading of brakes is essential when engine performance increases but it must tie up with good suspensions and especially tires! However, one must know the fundamentals and physics before modding. Whats good with so much power but car cannot stop rite...?
I am sure UUC has spent engineering hours to design a good and reliable brake system.
Do they have for EVOs?
Racebred
Core Group Members
i think for us amatuers here, getting a race set-up with perfect brake distribution could be disasterous. That's why in 99% of road cars there's always a front biased brake distribution.
It's the same reason why understeer is always dialled into your stock suspension even if it's for RWD or AWD cars. It's for safety coz understeer is much easier to manage.
Tyre pressure is also advised similarly to promote understeer. And on the North South highway, if i ever have to do any emergency braking or lane changing, i better pray that my car understeers rather than oversteer.
A lot of people upgrade their suspension and anti-roll bars to promote car neutrality. Maybe some people mod like this coz neutral handling is advocated in all websites and it's simply being repeated numerous times. So garbage in-garbage out, people just follow.
But how many can handle a car thus modded. In a split second emergency, when you're doing heavy braking, can you balance steering and braking, to provide optimum grip before drifting occurs? Neutral handling is the fine line in between over and understeering. It's very easy to cross over that very fine line into dangerous oversteering territory by just simply giving jerky steering inputs, or sharp throttle lift-off, for eg.
In this case, it becomes potentially dangerous for the driver if he is not skillful enough. So in short, for modders, drive within your limits and know what your mods are all about. dont simply follow the herd. If you want to reduce your own safety buffer, then make sure you are skillful enough to stay within the reduced safety zone.
If you know what you're doing. Doing these mods can greatly improve your driving. The driver must always match the mods.
It's the same reason why understeer is always dialled into your stock suspension even if it's for RWD or AWD cars. It's for safety coz understeer is much easier to manage.
Tyre pressure is also advised similarly to promote understeer. And on the North South highway, if i ever have to do any emergency braking or lane changing, i better pray that my car understeers rather than oversteer.
A lot of people upgrade their suspension and anti-roll bars to promote car neutrality. Maybe some people mod like this coz neutral handling is advocated in all websites and it's simply being repeated numerous times. So garbage in-garbage out, people just follow.
But how many can handle a car thus modded. In a split second emergency, when you're doing heavy braking, can you balance steering and braking, to provide optimum grip before drifting occurs? Neutral handling is the fine line in between over and understeering. It's very easy to cross over that very fine line into dangerous oversteering territory by just simply giving jerky steering inputs, or sharp throttle lift-off, for eg.
In this case, it becomes potentially dangerous for the driver if he is not skillful enough. So in short, for modders, drive within your limits and know what your mods are all about. dont simply follow the herd. If you want to reduce your own safety buffer, then make sure you are skillful enough to stay within the reduced safety zone.
If you know what you're doing. Doing these mods can greatly improve your driving. The driver must always match the mods.
piggyboyz said:
one can mess around with other deteminants of brake force besides just caliper size - ones like input and/or output piston areas, pad area.
fred puhn has a very good book on brake systems. old but very good.. and it is cheap. its ISBN is 0-89586-232-8
