Lambo Cui

[Crufty Dusty]

Re: Lambo Cui

Exactly.. take a look at the utility models vs the sports models

Now that is a confirmation bias. Look at the Mid-Size Luxury models. As a group they are just as bad if not worse than the Mid-Size Sports models, especially on Collision claims. Keep in mind that Luxury and Sports models tend to cost more than your average vehicle.

Also, do they specify the severity of collision? Big wrecks, not fender benders..

The numbers are normalized to 100 for the "average loss".

Ford rates the 20 most dangerous vehicles of 2007. A lot of them are SUVs or pickups, which runs counter to "intuition". The S2000 is the sole entry in the "Sport" category. :laughlik:

Top 20 Most Dangerous Vehicles - Forbes.com

 

[Shaun]

Re: Lambo Cui

average loss.. but big wrecks? what proportion?
1 big wreck vs 50 fender benders... which one is it? and what sort of driving causes each?

from my earlier post "There are distinct differences between Singapore and the US, China, etc. that affect the observation. I'm sure you can list some key differences." Can you?

 

[Crufty Dusty]

Re: Lambo Cui

average loss.. but big wrecks? what proportion?
1 big wreck vs 50 fender benders... which one is it? and what sort of driving causes each?

Here are some stats from Traffic Police for 2007/2008.

Singapore Police Force - Traffic Annual

Under Table 9A, "CAUSES OF ACCIDENTS BY SEVERITY OF INJURY SUSTAINED". "Exceeding road/vehicle speed limit"... in 2007 there were 2 cases of which none were fatal. In 2008 there were 4 cases of which 2 were fatal. There were 269 cases in 2007 and 258 in 2008 respectively. 2 deaths out of 258... can we agree that is insignificant? Even if we include "Skidding due to excessive speed", of which there were 2 deaths in 2008, it would still be insignificant.

BTW "Illegal racing on the road".... zero cases in both years.

So what's the major cause of fatalities on the roads in 2008?

#1 Failing to have proper control (73)
#2 Failing to keep proper lookout (70)
#3 Failing to give way to traffic with right of way (22).

from my earlier post "There are distinct differences between Singapore and the US, China, etc. that affect the observation. I'm sure you can list some key differences." Can you?

Key difference is the fact that the #1 most vulnerable traffic users are motorcyclists. Refer to Table 8B "VEHICLES INVOLVED IN FATAL ROAD ACCIDENTS BY TYPE, 1999-2008". 120 of 317 deaths in 2008 were involving motorcycles which formed the largest group. No data on sub-category of cars.

 

[Shaun]

Re: Lambo Cui

Here are some stats from Traffic Police for 2007/2008.

Singapore Police Force - Traffic Annual

Under Table 9A, "CAUSES OF ACCIDENTS BY SEVERITY OF INJURY SUSTAINED". "Exceeding road/vehicle speed limit"... in 2007 there were 2 cases of which none were fatal. In 2008 there were 4 cases of which 2 were fatal. There were 269 cases in 2007 and 258 in 2008 respectively. 2 deaths out of 258... can we agree that is insignificant? Even if we include "Skidding due to excessive speed", of which there were 2 deaths in 2008, it would still be insignificant.

BTW "Illegal racing on the road".... zero cases in both years.

So what's the major cause of fatalities on the roads in 2008?

#1 Failing to have proper control (73)
#2 Failing to keep proper lookout (70)
#3 Failing to give way to traffic with right of way (22).

So the US data is not detailed enough especially for the context.

Now with these local stats you've provided...
When that Evo street racer kid ran the stop light and killed the taxi driver, does his act fall under illegal racing? Or "disobeying traffic light signals resulting in accident with vehicle"?

How do the cops prove illegal street racing? Have to catch those involved and get a confession out of them yes? Or have vid cams to record the act and get the license plates? What are the odds of that at night at speed? In this recent Evo case there's chatter of two different license plate numbers at the scene...which suggests hiding, or increased likelihood of intent to evade.

When mr hotshoe is running around at speed and crashes bad but survives is he doing to admit to the cops he was racing his beng brother? Or does he make up some excuse about losing control after a dog ran across the road while he was cruising slightly above the speed limit? Or that he just didn't see the other vehicle at the junction? Fell asleep, modified vehicle malfunctioned, etc.?

 

[ahjayeson]

Re: Lambo Cui

How do the cops prove illegal street racing? Have to catch those involved and get a confession out of them yes? Or have vid cams to record the act and get the license plates? What are the odds of that at night at speed? In this recent Evo case there's chatter of two different license plate numbers at the scene...which suggests hiding, or increased likelihood of intent to evade.

Factually correct to link having 2 different number plates on a car to evasion, but is it possible that the deceased is a car trader who has just done number plate retention and conveniently thrown the old plate inside the car?

For all the reference to data, correlation and statistics, your insinuation is painfully insensitive to friends and family who are still seeking closure.

 

[pbear1973]

Re: Lambo Cui

average loss.. but big wrecks? what proportion?
1 big wreck vs 50 fender benders... which one is it? and what sort of driving causes each?

from my earlier post "There are distinct differences between Singapore and the US, China, etc. that affect the observation. I'm sure you can list some key differences." Can you?

I'm not sure when we moved on to big wrecks. The lambo that started this discussion wasn't particularly wrecked. It was very expensively damaged (because it's a lambo.. a single door panel can run into 5 digits), but not exactly wrecked.

Are we now talking about cars that are insurance write-offs only? See that's the thing; this discussion has moved goal posts so many times that I'm now confused.. from a not-that-badly wrecked lambo to big wrecks, from true performance cars to honda civics.. I stand by my initial assertion that unless it's a CTR, Hondas are not hot cars. Otherwise might as well throw in Corollas, Vios and even a Kia S-Koop. How about Proton? WIth their Lotus tuned suspensions?

 

[Shaun]

Re: Lambo Cui

I'm not sure when we moved on to big wrecks.

lol let's not play ignorant mate

Go back to very early in this thread.. post 16:

"2) Try and find any sort of news report of these cars in car-car accidents (not involving other makes beyond the 5 most common as listed in (1) ) where halves get cut off or smashed up or thrown tens of meters, lose an entire wheel, causing big jams, etc."
post 27:
" Not just small accidents but accidents like this one where entire halves of the car get destroyed, wheel(s) gone, etc. Or other accidents where engines fly meters away, car wraps around tree, or gets chopped in half, flips, or crashes into wall and catches fire, etc. "

 

[Shaun]

Re: Lambo Cui

Factually correct to link having 2 different number plates on a car to evasion, but is it possible that the deceased is a car trader who has just done number plate retention and conveniently thrown the old plate inside the car?

It's possible.. and investigations by the authorities into the numbers will give them an answer.

For all the reference to data, correlation and statistics, your insinuation is painfully insensitive to friends and family who are still seeking closure.

I have no reason to put down the guy personally. But sometimes discussion can prevent a repeat of similarly sad events. If you think I'm bad, you should see what others have already said, completely out in the open on other forums, pure poison with no intention of discussing any issue. It's just another reason to drive sane so there are none of these consequences to face.

 

[pbear1973]

Re: Lambo Cui

lol let's not play ignorant mate

Go back to very early in this thread.. post 16:

"2) Try and find any sort of news report of these cars in car-car accidents (not involving other makes beyond the 5 most common as listed in (1) ) where halves get cut off or smashed up or thrown tens of meters, lose an entire wheel, causing big jams, etc."
post 27:
" Not just small accidents but accidents like this one where entire halves of the car get destroyed, wheel(s) gone, etc. Or other accidents where engines fly meters away, car wraps around tree, or gets chopped in half, flips, or crashes into wall and catches fire, etc. "

Alright.. granted. So the proton in Malaysia counts, yes?

 

[Shaun]

Re: Lambo Cui

yes many protons in msia are hot
some are fast too wiralutions etc

 

[pbear1973]

Re: Lambo Cui

yes many protons in msia are hot
some are fast too wiralutions etc

Hmmm at this rate every car is hot. I just saw a hot Corolla just now with big noisy exos and fierce body kit. Since my car only 320i i din dare race with him.

OT: TRD got supercharger for the Corolla. Since TRD is a subsidiary of Toyota, there's a very high chance of getting it LTA approved, just like the TRD supercharger for the IS200.

 

[ac323]

Re: Lambo Cui

Hmmm at this rate every car is hot. I just saw a hot Corolla just now with big noisy exos and fierce body kit. Since my car only 320i i din dare race with him.

OT: TRD got supercharger for the Corolla. Since TRD is a subsidiary of Toyota, there's a very high chance of getting it LTA approved, just like the TRD supercharger for the IS200.

Lolz...................drive safe ya




* anything settle at Sepang!!!!
cheers

 

[Shaun]

Re: Lambo Cui

Hmmm at this rate every car is hot.

not true... there are some models of car that are almost always left stock performance wise.. if I can list a few, surely you can too Look around on the roads heheh

 

[Crufty Dusty]

Re: Lambo Cui

lol let's not play ignorant mate

Go back to very early in this thread.. post 16:

"2) Try and find any sort of news report of these cars in car-car accidents (not involving other makes beyond the 5 most common as listed in (1) ) where halves get cut off or smashed up or thrown tens of meters, lose an entire wheel, causing big jams, etc."
post 27:
" Not just small accidents but accidents like this one where entire halves of the car get destroyed, wheel(s) gone, etc. Or other accidents where engines fly meters away, car wraps around tree, or gets chopped in half, flips, or crashes into wall and catches fire, etc. "

How about that out of control Malaysian bus that killed 12 in October? 11 killed in Malaysian bus accident

Accidents involving interstate buses are common in Malaysia and there are frequent allegations that some drivers take drugs to keep themselves awake.

Article: TWO FATAL ACCIDENTS NEAR SIMPANG AMPAT, NORTH-SOUTH HIGHWAY. | AccessMyLibrary - Promoting library advocacy
Breaking News
S'porean family of 4 killed in accident along north-south highway - Channel NewsAsia
SgForums :: Singapore's Online Community - Singaporean dies in Malaysia highway bus crash

Lots more.

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/North-South_Expressway,_Malaysia#Notable_incidents

 

[pbear1973]

Re: Lambo Cui

Lolz...................drive safe ya




* anything settle at Sepang!!!!
cheers

Haha.. too bad M Division doesn't make after-market FI systems for NA cars. Otherwise we can organize group buy and work together to get it LTA approved.

 

[pbear1973]

Re: Lambo Cui

not true... there are some models of car that are almost always left stock performance wise.. if I can list a few, surely you can too Look around on the roads heheh

The Honda Civic and Accord would be two of them. I've seen them mostly stock. Same with Proton Saga Gen2.

 

[marklee]

Re: Lambo Cui

All these examples don't prove a point..tionged chia vs non-tionged chia. Need solid stats to come to a conclusion...are there suchs stats around in sg?

 

[Shaun]

Re: Lambo Cui

erik are you serious? now you're bringing in buses? please read the thread from the start

do you have answers to the response to the SG stats you posted?

===

Mark - yes and your one liner does help the discussion greatly You're a friend of Nic?

 

[marklee]

Re: Lambo Cui

Unless we can see:

1. Breakdown in % of make & model of cars in fatal accidents
2. Population of make and model of cars
3. Breakdown in % of illegally modified cars in fatal accidents
4. Cars at fault in all accidents by make and model.

Hard to come to conclusion. For every example of tiong chia in fatal accident, can bring up an example of non-tiong chia in fatal accident.

My opinion is that the make and model of a car can be an indication of the driver's driving attitude. If I see a blinged out WRX with BOV, loud exhaust etc, I will stay away because I'm expecting him to drive recklessly...then again same goes to if I see a banged up Corolla with dings all over the place. There are always exceptions.

Shaun: Nic from Boss Motorsports? 318is? Not sure whether you are being sarcastic about my one-liner...written text is easily misinterpreted on the internet. Everybody chill lah

 

[Shaun]

Re: Lambo Cui

All these examples don't prove a point..tionged chia vs non-tionged chia. Need solid stats to come to a conclusion...are there suchs stats around in sg?

Erik has posted some, but inconclusive still because we're dealing with a very specific type of driving and accident. Stats can only bring you so far sometimes. Just gotta look around and be honest with yourself.

so..
no stats = no conclusion = all these mega crash evo, wrx, proton, honda drivers who have killed themselves and others, are just like an average road user and just happened to get unlucky? If you truly believe that after experiencing things yourself, talking to your enthusiast friends, looking at the news and what gets covered, then you are only ignoring reality..

not nic from boss..
nic the photographer.. the exotic car lover.. the one who likes blasting around on highways with the owners lol