AP, Alcon, PFB

Shaun

Well-Known Member
Trusted Sponsor
For now just AP and Alcon the two racing brake leaders... have to resize the other pictures sometime.
 
I think I have a brake fetish. :inlove:

How wide is that big AP caliper? Is that for custom rotors or do they have AP disc for that?
 
Tanzy said:
I think I have a brake fetish. :inlove:

How wide is that big AP caliper? Is that for custom rotors or do they have AP disc for that?

I love hardcore brakes too hehhehe

That caliper was a good 7 inches wide by my estimation. HUGE! It is meant to go with out of the discs in the AP catalog. Majority of discs being cast iron means that there are very few custom discs since you already have the mold anyway.

Dunno if such a wide disc would fit on a street car.. even if it did, the massive disc would be overkill for our trackday applications and harm handling, run too cool, etc. :ehhh:

Hey sorry to you and barry about MSN just now. I went out for dinner and left the computer unintentionally. I am hearing some hardcore news :thumbsup:
 
Whisky_Tango said:
Alcon looks better, can we have more pics on Alcon please...

Bro.. I can send you the full res pics if you want :) I don't have any more Alcon pics.. didn't take that many. Had 600,000 sq feet to cover.

Eh why do you say Alcon looks better? Just the color? The quality of both is about the same.. quality pistons, seals, fasteners.. monoblock, etc.
 
Shaun said:
Whisky_Tango said:
Alcon looks better, can we have more pics on Alcon please...

Bro.. I can send you the full res pics if you want :) I don't have any more Alcon pics.. didn't take that many. Had 600,000 sq feet to cover.

Eh why do you say Alcon looks better? Just the color? The quality of both is about the same.. quality pistons, seals, fasteners.. monoblock, etc.

Please do bro... Thanx... :)

Well...cos I have not seen the Alcon Brakes and would like to see more. But looking at the photos, I find tat Alcon design are more robust and reliable.

Cheers!...
 
How exactly do you gather that the Alcons are designed stronger? The AP X-beam is the butchest caliper I've ever seen. Monoblock and massive bridge as part of it!

Ok sending you the full res pics :)
 
Shaun said:
How exactly do you gather that the Alcons are designed stronger? The AP X-beam is the butchest caliper I've ever seen. Monoblock and massive bridge as part of it!

Well... Im juz comparing these two photos, looking only at the 4/6 pots and not the fat mama. The AP had grub screws holding the pieces and Alcon is a solid block. So I reckon tat Alcon is more robust and reliable. Just my views.

Shaun said:
Ok sending you the full res pics :)
Thanx bro... :)
 
ahh I see! Don't know whether those two are in the same price or application range. In those two pics, the Alcon is a monobloc whilst the AP is a 2 piece.

Monobloc material is very important. I know that AP uses some very stiff metal matrix composites esp in their Monoblocs. Alcon probably does too. I do know what both use pressure-formed billet.
 
Shaun said:
Monobloc material is very important. I know that AP uses some very stiff metal matrix composites esp in their Monoblocs. Alcon probably does too. I do know what both use pressure-formed billet.

Yes, material selection and heat treatment is very important. This will minimise the expansion rate.

Would love to visit this kind of exhibition shows rather than motorshows. Too bad Singapore market isn't big enuf to justify this kind.

Thanx for sharing with us here bro.

:thumbsup:
 
np Eric.

Yah modulus of elasticity - stiffness - to minimize deflection under load.

Actually it would have been right up your alley now that I think about it. I will post a portion of the 1000 pics I took, sometime soon in the IT folder.. specially for you in the IT folder. Mostly mechanical and electrical components, as well as the CNC or semi-digital machinery.
 
Shaun said:
np Eric.

Yah modulus of elasticity - stiffness - to minimize deflection under load.

Actually it would have been right up your alley now that I think about it. I will post a portion of the 1000 pics I took, sometime soon in the IT folder.. specially for you in the IT folder. Mostly mechanical and electrical components, as well as the CNC or semi-digital machinery.

Thanx for ur generous and thoughtful gesture. However no offence bro... if its specially for me, I would prefer if you can send them to my email as this will not chalk up the forum's space.

But if you think tat those are informative, please post them in the Brake folder for all of us?

Cheers bro! :thumbsup:
 
Shaun,

Thinking of increasing rear brake power. It's too front biased now. Locking up the fronts easily causing understeer. Getting Barry to source 4 pot rears and steel hoses for me.
 
Whisky_Tango said:
Thanx for ur generous and thoughtful gesture. However no offence bro... if its specially for me, I would prefer if you can send them to my email as this will not chalk up the forum's space.

But if you think tat those are informative, please post them in the Brake folder for all of us?

Cheers bro! :thumbsup:

it's not about brakes.. about other things. Actually I thought Barry, Allan, Shawn, and potentially a few others, might enjoy them too.
 
Tanzy said:
Shaun,

Thinking of increasing rear brake power. It's too front biased now. Locking up the fronts easily causing understeer. Getting Barry to source 4 pot rears and steel hoses for me.

not sure if you want to try and find the brake balance by mixing and matching hardware since if you go too far, you have to change hardware again to bring it back. It gets very costly. If there are bias bars that fit your car then those would be better. I have heard that modern street cars modify brake balance via wheel speed sensors, in such case, a stronger caliper or larger rotor in the rear would not help.

Assuming your feelings about brake force being too front-biased are true, finding the optimal balance would yield some laptime improvements, but probably not a lot because I sincerely believe that the stock bias cannot be that car from ideal. You will be able to decelerate harder before losing it with a given steering input, but not by a whole lot.

I also believe that a driver, especially a relatively new track driver, should do everything he can to work with the characteristics of a car (one just well maintained and that handles anywhere near ok), and learn how to adapt to it, rather than immediately change the hardware to suit him. Given some time, he will learn somemore things about driving and then he can more efficiently change the car in the proper way.

IMHO man :)
 
Shaun,

I know what you are talking about. What I am worried is not the track. It's more road safety. Locking up the fronts suddenly into a turn is damn dangerous on the roads. On the track, I will seldom go on the brakes mid-bend but things are not so predictable on the road.
 
Doesn't the ABS allow you to steer while braking?
 
Shaun,

In the ideal world, in the product brochure, it will but in real life, ABS is so retarded. The ABS results in a bizarre sensation as the handling becomes erratic with the brake pulses. Kinda like on and off grip on the road. I'm still on 36psi for my AD07 but it was worse at 32psi.
 
Shaun said:
it's not about brakes.. about other things. Actually I thought Barry, Allan, Shawn, and potentially a few others, might enjoy them too.

Me bad, din notice its not about brakes. :oops:

Cool... look forward to it. :thumbsup:

Thanx in advance.
 

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